A Conversation with Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

[00:00:04.860] – Steve Barkley

I’m pleased to welcome Dr. Khalid Mumin, the current superintendent of the Reading School district in Pennsylvania, to Leaders Learning from Leaders. Dr. Mumin served as the Reading School district Superintendent from 2014 to 2021, before taking on other leadership roles, including Pennsylvania’s Secretary of Education. He holds a doctor of education and Educational Leadership from the University of Pennsylvania, a Master’s of Education and Teaching and Curriculum from Pennsylvania State University, and a Bachelor of Arts in Secondary English Education from Shippensburg University. Dr. Mumin was selected as the Pennsylvania Superintendent of the Year by the Pennsylvania Association of School Superintendents, and he was recognized as a National Superintendent of the Year finalist by the School Superintendents Association. He returned to Reading School district to serve as superintendent in July of 2025. Welcome, Khalid.

[00:01:15.100] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Thank you so much, Steve. I’m so happy to be here today.

[00:01:18.560] – Steve Barkley

I’m wondering if you’d start us off with a little bit of background information about the Reading School district.

[00:01:26.460] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Oh, absolutely. Well, the Reading School district here in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania is the fourth largest district in the Commonwealth, the third largest urban district. We have approximately 18,000 students. We fluctuate between 17,500 to 18,500 students. Our demographics here, we are a district that is 88% Latino, Latino and Hispanic here in the Commonwealth. Our students, we We’re an underserved district in regards to funding and regards to socioeconomic status. We are a district that is 100% free and reduced meals, where many of our students live in poverty, and we have it scaled in three levels: poverty, acute poverty, poverty and acute poverty. But one thing that resonates deeply here is the pride that Reading has and the opportunities that the school system presents in regards to providing students with the opportunity to chart their own course when they graduate from Reading High to Castle on the Hill. A beautiful community. We’re about 45 miles outside of Philadelphia, outside of Philadelphia, sitting in between Philly and Harrisburg. Harrisburg, which is our capital. We’re in close proximity to New York City, very close proximity into Maryland. It’s just a great area to be in here in Pennsylvania because we can get everywhere in a matter of a couple of hours.

[00:03:06.480] – Steve Barkley

Looking back at those first years that you served as superintendent in Reading, what were some of the key issues that you had to tackle during those years? What carries over that’s the same today or what’s different today from your first term there?

[00:03:27.280] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

My first time around here in Reading, it was big push to understand our changing demographics. Our Latino students, it was a progression of Latino students entering and families entering Reading over the past 20 years, where we went from 10% Latinos to 80% when I was here the first time around. From that standpoint, it gave us an opportunity to look at how we educate students who are coming from diverse backgrounds backgrounds backgrounds. Taking a look at how our standardized assessments don’t clearly indicate or give clear indicators of the possibilities of success for our children. Changing the narrative from focusing simply on standardized testing to moving to a constructivist view where students are demonstrating that learning by doing was one of my major focus areas. Secondly, we had to look at communication and engagement. We really stepped out there. We wanted to be a district where we’re not communicating simply to our parents, students, and community, but it was reciprocal, where we weren’t simply an outbox. We were consumers of information, and we’re able to establish communication pathways where it’s reciprocated. Also, operational effectiveness, financial and operational effectiveness was a huge task to really overcome because at the time, Pennsylvania did not have a process for fair funding here in Pennsylvania.

[00:05:07.010] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

And I’m quite sure that’ll come out in our discussion, our discussions from then to now throughout some of the questions in this engagement. And so looking at funding and saying we need resources, and it takes a little bit more when you’re dealing with students or leading students from underserved communities. Also, trying to attract and retain teachers, attract, recruit, and retain teachers was an issue. So we had a lot of things in the hopper at that time. And lastly, which came to be one of our most important points to our success, was re-engaging our partners saying, This is the Reading School district. We are the city of Reading. We are your partner. And look, we have immediate workforce-ready students here that are graduating from our high school. So it was a combination of really five things to be succinct: safe and supportive schools, academics, looking at academic achievement, communication and engagement, finance and organizational effectiveness in partnerships. So we had a lot going on back in 2014, and we yielded some very positive results over the years.

[00:06:24.620] – Steve Barkley

I was just going to check. It sounds like you had a lot to learn and a lot to do during that time frame.

[00:06:33.020] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Absolutely. And the thing about leadership, which is so powerful, is that I found back then my success really was dependent on how much I knew about the community, how much we were bringing the community and the partners in, how much we were listening to student voice and parent voice and parent choice to be able to make these decisions. It’s cliché saying having an open Our policy was one of the major conduit for our success. But what I mean by open door is this. It’s not simply the door is open and you walk into the office and meet with the superintendent. It’s the superintendent, the administration, the teachers, the support staff, we’re in the community, which makes us accessible. And so that was extremely important because when families and students get to see you in unstructured times in the community, you’re able to really cash in on that investment of relationship building. And so that’s what I mean by open door. We were everywhere, and I was everywhere in this community and really enjoying myself. I wanted to be with the people and had a lot of fun doing it, a lot of fun doing it.

[00:07:51.040] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

They have established some very positive and sustainable friendships and relationships over the years.

[00:07:57.720] – Steve Barkley

I’m wondering how you carry what you learned and accomplished during those years into the role of Secretary of Education for the state.

[00:08:09.920] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Wow. That’s a great question, Steve. Back in 2014, as you hear my messaging and I talk about the five areas, it was more around advocacy, advocacy for our learners. It was more around advocacy for resources, advocacy for fair funding. And we were very fortunate that years ago, this was 2015, we were in the throes of an impasse with the state government here for funding. And the Reading School district, we received close to 90% of our funding from the state. During that impasse, I had an invitation to meet with some of the legislators in regards to what a fair funding formula would look like and how it could benefit students in the Reading School district and other urban districts, as well as rural school districts here in the Commonwealth. Our one sheeter was presented on the floor of the House and the Senate. And when the budget passed, the fair funding formula was launched here in the Reading School district with then Governor Wolf. Second time around, which is like a dream come true, I met with Governor Shapiro, our current governor here in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, and he said, What is your vision for education, Dr. Mumin?

[00:09:32.160] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

And I’m going, my hands are going. I’m talking about the five areas. I’m talking about advocacy and all that. And he said, We’re going to get stuff done. I said, Oh, my goodness. And sure enough, day one on the job, after his inauguration speech, we were off and running. And what I learned at that level is that when looking at schools holistically, holistically, schools are pretty much the same, the same things. Whereas students want opportunities, parents want opportunities and choice, resources are of paramount importance, and hiring highly qualified teachers. Everyone wants that in a common well. And what I learned at state government, which has helped me in this role now, is that we don’t have to, and I’m a former basketball player, there is a move called a pump fake. And so you pump fake to try to get the defender in the air, and then you create a move or complete a move. But sometimes you have players who pump fake and pump fake, and pump fake, pump fake, pump fake, just to pass the ball. And what I learned with the leadership of Governor Shapiro, it’s like, Here’s the idea. Is it good for kids?

[00:10:51.400] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Is it good for the community? Can we do this? Let’s go. Let’s stop with the pump faking. Shoot the ball. And that is That is something I learned that I bring back with me today. If the plan is fiscally responsible, it’s good for students. We have the opportunity for our teachers to get the professional development to move with these techniques and skills, and we are the voice of advocacy for our children and influential leaders, forming these positive relationships where it’s a community thing that when one student graduates, that means we all graduate. We can do it quickly and efficiently. And that’s what I learned, which mapped on to some of my prior experiences where I talk about the three E’s. Empowerment, that means hiring good leaders. Efficiency, Effectiveness without the pump fakes. Let’s go. E, E, E. E, E, E. One, two, three. No pump fake, pump fake, pump fake, just to pass. We got to shoot the ball because the ball is in our court to provide opportunities of access, opportunities of workforce success, opportunities of success at our higher Ed institutions, we hold that ball. Don’t pump, fake, and hold it. Don’t pump, fake, and hold it.

[00:12:14.170] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Shoot the ball and give our students the opportunity to succeed.

[00:12:18.620] – Steve Barkley

As I’m listening to you, you use the word we rather frequently. Oh, absolutely. I’m going to ask you that I’m sure that’s part of your leadership. So talk a little bit about that.

[00:12:31.460] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Yes. There’s an old saying that says, there is no I in team. But then when you flip that, some people say, but there’s an M and an E. I believe that leadership never should rely solely on one leader. You have to have very smart people in the room, people who are going to challenge the leader to step outside of the box. You’re going to be challenged to have staff members that are able to say, Hey, I’m sorry, Dr. Mumin, that idea is old like gold. We’re talking about platinum now, and you have to be open and reflective of that. I say we because I try my best to hire the very brightest and competent professionals to have in the room to be as thought partners in this work. Leaders that are not only masters of the Socratic seminar, but they are also masters of implementation. My goal is to empower them to do their jobs because when they’re empowered and they have the resources, that makes us more efficient as a system system which gets to student effectiveness more quickly. I recognize that as a leader, and I’m okay with that. My job is to stay out on…

[00:13:55.980] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

I stay out in the head looking visionary. This is what the future This is how we have to continually prepare our students. But the experts in the room, those are the ones that get us to full implementation and get us moving efficiently and quickly. I know this isn’t work that I could do all by myself. And any leader, I would be remiss if I didn’t say this, if you hear a leader that says, It all falls on me. I’m the end all, be all to this and that, and it’s simply an authoritative stance of leadership, grab your bags and run. Run fast. You have to have great minds around you in the room, great minds in regards to your planning, great minds that give you alignment, to provide alignment and resources for your visionary aspects of this work. So yes, I depend on my team heavily, and I’m very proud of them, especially for the successes we’ve had over the years and the new challenges we’re going to embark upon now.

[00:14:58.000] – Steve Barkley

Well, that word challenge has That takes me into the next question I wanted to ask. What do you see as… I guess I want to ask some of the challenges that people at that superintendent level across the country are facing today. But I don’t want to miss challenge without putting the word opportunity with it.

[00:15:22.300] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Wow. I think challenges are… They’re part of the makeup of leadership. If If everything was easy, we wouldn’t have leaders that stand out front that have to create vision and create strategy to address issues. I hearken back to when we talk about challenging opportunity, I hearken back to a quote by Dr Martin Luther King Jr, where he says, The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy. That’s leadership. Leaders have to embrace the challenge, embrace the challenges that are ahead, and be able to navigate challenge and change. Challenge and change. It’s something I can’t really quantify or describe it as a recipe, so to speak. It happens in the now. I think that there is a statement that I use here in my in the district. I say, With change, there’s loss, and opportunity. Very similar with challenges. With challenges, challenges may require change. And opportunity, presents opportunities. So being the leader out front, you always have to have that intrinsic motivation to say that, Here’s the challenge, and we will see our way through this challenge for the betterment of our students and student success.

[00:17:07.920] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

So it’s something that drives me as a leader. Challenges really drive me. When I’m working with my colleagues or if I’m doing some mentoring or presenting, I always, and again, I hearken back again to athletic examples. I think of Michael Jordan, all right? I think of Michael Jordan, who seemed to reach his apex as a champion, decides he wants to play baseball, goes off and plays baseball. Oh, boy, I’m going back to the Bulls. Here’s another big challenge and wins again. Sometimes leaders have to create their own bogeyman to stay agile, to stay to stay agile, to stay informed, to stay visionary. This is an athletic example that I will use, and I am a Philadelphia Eagles fan. E-a-g-l-e-s, Eagles. I am an Eagles fan. All right? Now, wear that proudly. However, one of the best quarterbacks that I have ever seen in the game is Tom braided of the New England Patriots. Why? Because Tom braided, he was not like Peyton Manning, who would go up and do diagnostic work at the line and call the defenses out. Nope, Tom braided goes into the huddle, has a plan, steps back in that pocket, goes to implement that plan, delivers the ball while in the pocket on the numbers, knowing he’s going to take a hit.

[00:18:49.640] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Knowing he’s going to take a hit. That’s how I map that on to challenges, presenting great opportunities. Yes, it’s a challenge being in the pocket and you have five or six 300 pound linemen coming after you. But the plan is already in motion. Delivering the ball on the numbers while taking the hit and moving the downs, moving down the field. That’s leadership in a nutshell. You have to be prepared and equipped to embrace the challenges of controversy. But knowing that once you get through that controversy, if you have a well-designed plan and you’re rolling with that plan with fidelity, you’re going to hit your team member on the numbers and you’re going to move the chains first down. Let’s go. Keep it moving.

[00:19:42.060] – Steve Barkley

There’s a phrase that I use that there is no mountaintop in teaching or leading.

[00:19:50.260] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

That’s right.

[00:19:51.200] – Steve Barkley

Or learning. That’s right. If you’ve chosen to come into this education field, you don’t need to worry about hitting mastery prior retirement.

[00:20:01.240] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

That’s a good way to look at it.

[00:20:04.060] – Steve Barkley

There’s always another next piece there for you.

[00:20:06.860] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

That’s right. That commitment of being a lifelong learner. Steve, I think about the teaching certificates here in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. When you’re a new teacher, and this was back in the 1900s when I was a new teacher, you look at your certificate, you entered a classroom with great energy, great joy, and you want to help change the world. I always remember from my certificate, it says, Khalid Mumin is certified in the art of teaching in the subject of English, the art of teaching. When you think of it that way, you’re an artist. Every teacher, every educator is an artist. Very similar to Flannery Gabriele Connery, when she would write, she would always use broad strokes, imagery, colors, all of her covers of her books had Peacocks on them. Whereas each author, or in this case, educator is an artist. Everyone’s strokes aren’t going to look the same. Everyone is not going to have the same penmanship. Everyone’s not going to follow the same design plan, letter for letter, because that’s not good teaching. You have to have the artistry to step outside of the box, make adjustments, and do what’s right for your students so they have the opportunity to succeed.

[00:21:36.540] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

And that’s the beauty of education, especially strong pedagogy and instruction. But when you get into a leadership position, you have to wear that on your sleeve that there is no one prescribed way to get to success. You have to examine several techniques and look at several tools over and over again to get to that desired outcome. You have to be an artist in this role.

[00:22:05.600] – Steve Barkley

So the art of the superintendent?

[00:22:08.240] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Yes, the art of the superintendent. Cool.

[00:22:11.880] – Steve Barkley

Just one other piece as I’ve been listening to you. As you describe what you’re working to make happen for the educators, it seems to line up for me that you’re talking the same for your students. The idea of challenge and opportunity community is what you’re preparing your students for.

[00:22:33.780] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

That’s right. Absolutely. There’s a gift within controversy. When you overcome controversy, when you overcome a barrier, It builds resiliency. Resiliency cannot be quantified. Resiliency is something that’s established through experience. That’s my thinking there. When you are able to work with a young person where they’re able to navigate through various experiences, some being extremely successful, some causing great challenge, what comes out at the end is a stronger, more confident learner. And so as we are committed as leaders, as lifelong learners, we have young people who we’re trying to get into the mix as that lifelong learner. Life is going to be filled with learning experiences. And I look at it like this. It’s similar to running a marathon. And it took me years to understand this. I never knew that marathon runners actually had teams. A team of runners, they’re running together, and their goal is to get one of their teammates across the finish line. So they’ll get into formation where they’re blocking wind for their teammate. They get into formations where you They’re coaching, they’re running faster in certain points to have that one teammate step up the pace, knowing that we’re all working together collectively for this one runner to get across the finish line.

[00:24:13.960] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

I look at educators as this. The educators are the participants that are sometimes on that team and most of the time on the sidelines. Whereas runners are running and they’re providing the potassium, they’re throwing They’re providing the bananas. They’re providing the electrolytes, throwing in the electrolyte drinks to them and coaching them. You got 2. 5 miles left. Let’s go. And then they take an interval with the runner to keep that one runner moving forward to get across that finish line. That’s education in the nutshell. Our jobs are to first lead, to present opportunities of access, to present opportunities of ideas of what success looks like when you complete. But it’s diverse. You have to be able to lead, you have to be able to support, you have to be able to push, you have to be able to motivate because the end result is you want a graduate that walks across the stage, prepared to engage in this ever-changing society. And like I said earlier, I was open by saying my first year of teaching was in the late 1900s. Teaching in the late 1900s looks a lot different than 2025. The profession and the workforce is different now.

[00:25:38.360] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

When you have students and you say, What do you want to be when you grow up? Well, I want to be a content creator. Wow. If that’s the case, we have to provide access to that. Another one is, I want to be a computer programmer. So what type of programmer are you talking? Well, I have this idea of a game that I’ve been thinking of. Okay, we have to be equipped with that through our STEM careers. You have students, which I love education today. Some of the things that I have access to and exposure to, if I was able to have the tools, the tools that we’re providing for our students, like cadaver boards, I probably would have gone into the health sciences. My mother tried to push me into health sciences, and I told her, Mom, I’m not good at science. I’m a good patient. I see myself as a good long term patient, not a doctor. But if I had a cadaver board, okay, just think of this. I was educated in the late 1900s. We didn’t have cadaver boards. We had to game operation that was not interactive. Cadaver boards where you’re able to see real human figures, real bones, real organs, and you’re able manipulate them and get to a desired outcome.

[00:27:03.280] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

If I had that opportunity to demonstrate with hands-on learning like that, I probably would have gone into the health sciences as my mother suggested. We have to be able to stay agile and out front in regards to the trends of what our workforce looks like in front of the trends and what our opportunities look at, how they look in higher Ed. Also, something that I’ve been talking about all week with students when I meet with them. I am just fascinating. I lived through their lives vicariously with this. The sense of being an entrepreneur. I come from a generation where it was good to be seen but not heard. This generation now, they want to be seen and heard and heard and seen and heard over and over again. They are very comfortable with exercising voice, which it’s phenomenal to see, especially when they have articulate discussions around their areas of focus. I just sit back and smile from ear to ear.

[00:28:19.460] – Steve Barkley

Well, before we close out, there’s one phrase I wanted to run by you. As I was doing my homework to get ready for the podcast, I got a chance to look at several clips of you that I could find online. The word believing comes. I wanted to give you a chance to talk about where that fits into your leadership.

[00:28:44.960] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Wow. Believe, it comes down to… I look at educational leadership. Sometimes you have to look at the person in the mirror and reflect upon why you entered the profession or the art of teaching. The piece of understanding that you have major influence, you have a major responsibility of having your fingerprints on the design of teaching, learning, pedagogy, and instruction, and your fingertips in regards to supporting students to reach their full potential. Sometimes we forget that. We forget that because there are a lot of things that come in a pipe. You have a lot of new initiatives. You have a lot of ebbs and flows in regards to curriculum and instruction and new techniques. The careers are changing right before our eyes. But we entered this profession for a reason with a purpose. When I say believe, it’s having the confidence, that intrinsic motivation to know that you are equipped as an educator educator with the head and heart alignment to do this work. You are one of the chosen ones. You are an educator. You are extremely important. I really honed in on believe when I would hear teachers say, Steve, So what do you do for a living?

[00:30:16.330] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Well, I’m only a third-grade teacher. Only? No. When you think of opportunities, when you think of adjusting to the workforce, the workforce of today, the workforce of the future, when you think of trends and ideas, and of course, when you’re getting on that scholarly level of ideas, everything begins in the education system. Whether it’s education in a school, whether it’s education at home, whether it’s education in the community. And leaders, in those settings, I always say are educators, you have to have the belief that you have have the power to change the world. The future depends on us to be able to equip our learners with the tools they need to have opportunity and access to compete in this ever-changing society. It’s never only this or only that. You are of paramount importance in this journey called education of lifelong learning.

[00:31:30.000] – Steve Barkley

Thank you. Thank you so much. My pleasure. It’s just been a delight to have this conversation with you. What’s the easiest or most preferred way, if there’s listeners who want to drop a question off to you, how would you like them to connect with you?

[00:31:47.720] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

You can go through any of the social media handles. I’m on Instagram as Dr. Khaled Mumin. I’m on LinkedIn, Dr. Khaled Mumin. Those two are easier to manage. Facebook, it’s just all types of stuff comes in there in direct message. I would say probably LinkedIn.

[00:32:09.360] – Steve Barkley

We’ll post both of those in the podcast, make it easier for folks to find.

[00:32:14.160] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Fantastic.

[00:32:14.860] – Steve Barkley

Thank you so much. Really appreciate it.

[00:32:17.240] – Dr. Khalid N. Mumin

Thank you. This has been a pleasure. It’s always good to talk about education and the opportunities and the infinite possibilities of success for our learners. I’m just so happy to be here to be able to share a few words.